Login
Username:

Password:

Remember me



Lost Password?

Register now!
Main Menu
Who's Online
1 user(s) are online (1 user(s) are browsing Forum)

Members: 0
Guests: 1

more...

Browsing this Thread:   1 Anonymous Users



« 1 (2) 3 4 »


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2007/4/16 6:26
From Norway
Group:
Member
Posts: 4023
Offline
Would be very cool if you get this working.

Posted on: 7/6 22:35
_________________
www.aspireos.com
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2012/2/20 23:57
From Astoria, Oregon
Group:
Member
Posts: 34
Offline
Quote:

nikolaos wrote:
Would be very cool if you get this working.


It will be cool if WE get it working!

(WE = whoever gets that part working first and this part is important enough to be a collective effort to get that part working for us and benefits us not just AROS/IcarosDesktop but also those on non-x86 systems like PPC Amiga platforms, MorphOS, etc.)




Posted on: 7/6 23:23
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2008/7/23 6:04
Group:
Member
Posts: 218
Offline
Quote:

RickAstoria wrote:

(WE = whoever gets that part working first and this part is important enough to be a collective effort to get that part working for us and benefits us not just AROS/IcarosDesktop but also those on non-x86 systems like PPC Amiga platforms, MorphOS, etc.)

AROS, MorphOS and AOS all use somewhat different APIs for 3D graphics.

Anyway, leopard-webkit, which is based on a fairly recent Webkit version, does provide WebGL on old MacOS releases for PowerPC hardware. I tested this a while ago and it does work for simple WebGL demos at least.

That said, in terms of overall performance, this is more interesting for AROS. In theory at least. In practice, a lot of the existing users run AROS hosted or virtualized and lack proper access to 3D hardware acceleration so WebGL would be of little use to them.

Still, any improvements you can do add to Odyssey would be welcome I am sure.

Posted on: 7/6 23:55
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2004/4/3 13:20
Group:
Member
Posts: 352
Offline
Quote:

A-Siegel wrote:

In practice, a lot of the existing users run AROS hosted or virtualized and lack proper access to 3D hardware acceleration so WebGL would be of little use to them.


AROS hosted on Linux can use 3d hardware acceleration. In this video at 2:20 it shows Doom 3 running.

https://vimeo.com/191163338


Posted on: 7/7 0:37
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2012/2/20 23:57
From Astoria, Oregon
Group:
Member
Posts: 34
Offline
Quote:

A-Siegel wrote:
Quote:

RickAstoria wrote:

(WE = whoever gets that part working first and this part is important enough to be a collective effort to get that part working for us and benefits us not just AROS/IcarosDesktop but also those on non-x86 systems like PPC Amiga platforms, MorphOS, etc.)

AROS, MorphOS and AOS all use somewhat different APIs for 3D graphics.

Anyway, leopard-webkit, which is based on a fairly recent Webkit version, does provide WebGL on old MacOS releases for PowerPC hardware. I tested this a while ago and it does work for simple WebGL demos at least.

That said, in terms of overall performance, this is more interesting for AROS. In theory at least. In practice, a lot of the existing users run AROS hosted or virtualized and lack proper access to 3D hardware acceleration so WebGL would be of little use to them.

Still, any improvements you can do add to Odyssey would be welcome I am sure.


I understand. While my project that would be using WebGL technology would benefit most on moderately strong hardware comparable to an i5 quad-core in performance power, there maybe ways to be able to get things working on lower spec systems but RAM and mass storage space are your biggest things that may bottle neck performance but WebGL via ANGLE at the timeframe of the r18xxx release (2015) would require at least video cards capable of Direct X 9.0c. (Geforce 6 series - Geforce 6xxx & ATI/AMD Radeon equivalent). However, the polygons and rendering level can put significant strain on say a sub-GHz computer. Of course, if they are using Windows or some other OS on major hardware specs, they can always use the Firefox based "browser-client" for my project I referenced to in the original post.

However, for AROS and other systems equivalent to an x86 made in the last 10 years with a competent video card running AROS native or one of the other OSs with equivalent hardware performance of a i3/i5 x86/x86-64 processor, or even high end model Android tablets made 5 years ago would conceivably work fine. To better improve AROS/AOS/MorphOS/etc. would be better facilities for accelerated hardware graphics. This would be really awesome.

My goal at the least would be for OWB (or a fork of it) to process even WebGL (at least v1.x specifications standard but 2.x specifications would be even cooler for OpenGL ES 3.0 facilities). Getting this across AOS, MorphOS, and AROS would be great.




Posted on: 7/7 0:58
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2010/8/30 7:20
Group:
Member
Posts: 1240
Offline
Quote:

RickAstoria wrote:
Lets make sure I get the toolchain setup right. Primarily, the computer used in Windows.

Have to get around to setting up a Linux setup but it's kind of crowded here...

It would be preferable to me to be able to work from within this Windows 10 system at this time so I would need make sure I have the appropriate toolchain for AROS from within the Windows operating system. I know it isn't Linux but I rather not have to reboot system to boot into Linux.


use vmware player.

install your preferred linux (i use lubuntu but maybe ubuntu inself or debian as such improved since).

install vmware tools to your guest to drag and drop data and share clipboard between windows host and linux vm, (important for convenience).

within linux, here are instructions how to build it:
http://aros.sourceforge.net/documentation/developers/compiling.php

and my additional info in post #3:

http://aros-exec.org/modules/newbb/vi ... hp?topic_id=10828&forum=2

its basically seting up necessary packages (note youll need proper version of flex 2.5.35 for few things like owb and grub2 but it depends if you want to build these at all) simple configuration command and make (eventually make bootiso).

you can test aros on:
1. hosted (linux and mingw under windows),
2. within vm(ware) (player), (youll need to install it from bootiso)
3. within qemu emulation, (youll need to install it from bootiso)
4. on a dedicated machine, (youll need to install it from bootiso)

hope that helps.

Posted on: 7/7 1:47
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2012/2/20 23:57
From Astoria, Oregon
Group:
Member
Posts: 34
Offline
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXlO_lAxLbw

Just some thoughts. I wouldn't want or expect WebGL to be something for everyone on the lower end of the hardware specs for AOS4, MorphOS, or AROS. It would be something that in my opinion should be user selectable as to whether it is enabled or disabled for a mainstream browser.

Using a customized OWB as a client for an online game, app or something else online, can be set by the game, app, or whatever developer as appropriate.

Personally, I'd be very interested in concurrent work in improving hardware accelerated graphics in native and hosted or virtualized environment when suitable graphic cards are present.

Doom 3 is a good inspiration. It can run on AROS. There is nothing I see that should prohibit such a game or equivalent from happening from inside a web browser with WebGL.

Here is another inspiration on what can be done with just WebGL (not the v2.0 but original v1.0 specs because 2.0 wasn't finalized until two 2016/2017.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=BV32Cs_CMqo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9KRBuVBjVo

Now, as far as asm.js support. I'm not exactly sure where that is in the OWB but still. The computer specs used by the person in the second link would be comparable to a system we would be using for AROS in the next 5 years. It was a high end system back in 2013.




Posted on: 7/7 2:36
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2012/2/20 23:57
From Astoria, Oregon
Group:
Member
Posts: 34
Offline
Quote:

wawa wrote:

use vmware player.

install your preferred linux (i use lubuntu but maybe ubuntu inself or debian as such improved since).

install vmware tools to your guest to drag and drop data and share clipboard between windows host and linux vm, (important for convenience).

within linux, here are instructions how to build it:
http://aros.sourceforge.net/documentation/developers/compiling.php

and my additional info in post #3:

http://aros-exec.org/modules/newbb/vi ... hp?topic_id=10828&forum=2

its basically seting up necessary packages (note youll need proper version of flex 2.5.35 for few things like owb and grub2 but it depends if you want to build these at all) simple configuration command and make (eventually make bootiso).

you can test aros on:
1. hosted (linux and mingw under windows),
2. within vm(ware) (player), (youll need to install it from bootiso)
3. within qemu emulation, (youll need to install it from bootiso)
4. on a dedicated machine, (youll need to install it from bootiso)

hope that helps.


Sound good. I might want to run Linux in the VMPlayer from a thumb drive or some Flash media for development but I probably could fit it in my remaining 1.4+ TB of free space of the main hard drive. It doesn't hurt me to use any distribution of Linux but for developmental purpose, at least one setup in Lubuntu would make sense so we are working on the same page with less headache that would result from running different distribution packages.


Posted on: 7/7 2:44
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2010/8/30 7:20
Group:
Member
Posts: 1240
Offline
Quote:

Just some thoughts. I wouldn't want or expect WebGL to be something for everyone on the lower end of the hardware specs for AOS4, MorphOS, or AROS.


keep in mind aros compiles from the same source for such a low spec systems as amiga.
first of all you can use conditionals for compilation of specific modules with specific flags for specific targets. consult for instance my mmakefile.src fo odyssey, specifcly sections like those beginning with:
ifneq ($(AROS_TARGET_CPU),i386)
...

It would be something that in my opinion should be user selectable as to whether it is enabled or disabled for a mainstream browser.

Quote:
Using a customized OWB as a client for an online game, app or something else online, can be set by the game, app, or whatever developer as appropriate.


it might even be a tooltype that specifies it. generally a featuret thats too heavy for certain system can simply be ommited by the user, specially if it doesnt consume resources while idle.

Quote:

Now, as far as asm.js support. I'm not exactly sure where that is in the OWB but still.


as you might see i have used a cmake flag to disable jit in my odyssey makefile for targets other than x86 and x64. just grep the source for capital JIT defines or undefines and you should be able to track it down. ive been through it initially but dont remember that offhand.


Posted on: 7/7 2:50
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: [Odyssey Web Browser wishlist ]: WebGL & dependencies necessary for use of Babylon.js & three.js

Joined:
2010/8/30 7:20
Group:
Member
Posts: 1240
Offline
Quote:

RickAstoria wrote:
The computer specs used by the person in the second link would be comparable to a system we would be using for AROS in the next 5 years. It


ill stay with amiga i guess;)

Posted on: 7/7 2:50
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer



« 1 (2) 3 4 »



You can view topic.
You cannot start a new topic.
You cannot reply to posts.
You cannot edit your posts.
You cannot delete your posts.
You cannot add new polls.
You cannot vote in polls.
You cannot attach files to posts.
You cannot post without approval.

[Advanced Search]


Search
Top Posters
1 paolone
paolone
4433
2 magorium
magorium
4095
3 nikolaos
nikolaos
4023
4 phoenixkonsole
phoenixkonsole
3929
5 deadwood
deadwood
2917
6 ncafferkey
ncafferkey
2796
7 mazze
mazze
2221
8 clusteruk
clusteruk
2112
9 damocles
damocles
1789
10 BSzili
BSzili
1513
© 2004-2018 AROS Exec